Homosexuality

[West the Hardcore Nerd]

I can say, in a quite determined manner, that being gay/bi/whatever is certainly not a choice, or else I totally would be gay/bi/whatever. I have no idea how to talk to girls, and, as such, I'll never have a girlfriend, ergo, I wish I was into other dudes.

 

[Scarlette]

Born this way baby! I was born a straight Female, and proud!



and I never woke up and chosed to like men, or other things like men with muscles :P it just happens, and I beilve we all are just born attracted to the same, gender, diffent gender or both! :D

I dont get why people would think its a choice, when its in the animal kingdom, and people have been raised, by diffrent gender parents, same gender parents, and single parent homes, have had more male friends, more female friends and all can be eigther, also they have done studies on twins and sometimes one twim is gay and the other isnt and have both grown up in the same enviorment.

Why cant other people just relaxe and let others love and have the same respect?!


and for some of you calling it a mental disease and being disrepectful, whats gonna happen if maybe your child is LGBTQ?

 

[Taemin]

^ That post is like.. /thread, in my opinion.

Though, the entire discussion in this thread will get roughly nowhere. :/ People who think it's a choice don't really seem to want to be swayed from thinking that, and the people who say it's not a choice won't drop that belief either. So what's the point? After pondering it, why does it matter? xD; I like debates like this well enough, but whether your straight or gay, or bi, etc, it's all just different ways that you can fall in love. We're all attracted to people differently, and we all fall in love differently. Love itself doesn't have to be so complicated.

I'm not about to close this thread, because discussion is on-going, buuut I'm done with it.
Just doesn't feel like it's moving.

It's not a choice, that's my story and I'm stickin' to it, and I'm out. xD

 

[Buttered Coat]

I'm bisexual (pretty damn proud of it, too!) and I didn't just wake up one morning and go 'yeah, I think I'll give chicks a go today!' I sort of slowly realized it over time, and now that I think about it, I've probably always been attracted to girls as well as guys (you know, after the whole kiddy-crush stages XD). I know earlier I said it could be either a choice or you could be born that way but I guess I'm going to kind of prove myself wrong here.

The majority of my friends are bi/gay, and not a single one of them said 'I've decided to start liking girls now' (the majority of my friends are also females. the bi/gay guys obviously didn't say that :P) or anything of the sort. One of them is gay because she had really bad experiences with guys earlier in her life, but that's still not a choice. She just really started hating men.

I'm not saying heterosexual people don't know what they're talking about and gays do, but because it's been a personal experience for me, I can safely say it's certainly not a choice. Believe me, neither my friends nor I enjoy having 'stupid lesbians!' shouted at us down the corridors at school or just in the middle of the mall. Though it's honestly the worst 'insult' they can come up with, it gets pretty tiring after a while. However, just because my friends and I are used to it, it doesn't mean such insults don't give people absolute hell. whether it's true or not, being picked on like that is not a joyful experience, and if being gay was a choice, no one would be gay for the sake of not getting picked on.

So, to completely ignore my previous post, it is definitely not a choice to be homosexual.

 

[Shining Raichu]

It's not a matter of knowing better than those who are homosexual. It's the fact that we have an opinion and a view of our very own that we perceive homosexuality in. If there was no such thing as opinion on this subject, this topic would already be closed. I'm not meaning to offend, so I apologize if I have or if I do in the future. It's not my intention. Homosexuality, heterosexuality, bisexuality, pansexuality... no matter which you are, there will always be views for each from a different side that may or may not be the truth in the carrier's eyes. You know who you are, what you are, and where you're going, but that doesn't mean everyone else will understand. This is a topic made to discuss the two ideas of how homosexuality may work, and possibly every other sexuality as well given the chance. And honestly many of the heterosexuals here, I'm sure, have been down the other road before when they were growing up.

This was stated to back up Syd's claim on how many of us don't have a completely untouched sexuality that has never changed.

Doesn't this entitle them to speak their thoughts on the whole deal as well? They must have some clue if they were there once. Of course they aren't full-fledged as many of the posters here are, but they may have felt an attraction to someone of the same sex before as well. If a full-fledged heterosexual speaks out here, they also have entitlement to speaking their observation. I find that even if you may not have experience with it, you may have an interesting view to share. They may not have experience of their very own to back up their words, but they have eyes in their sockets, and ears on their head. They should be enabled to give their thoughts without getting shat all over. This mostly applies to those who aren't speaking with negative intent towards the homosexuals here. :P

Idk, those are my thoughts anyway.
​

You don't have to worry about offending me, it's all good :)

I still stand by what I said though. I'm not trying to denounce the rights of others to have opinions on things, and what causes specific sexualities is certainly up for debate. However what is clear is that it's not a choice. The people who are actually of these sexualities in question are basically screaming "IT'S NOT A CHOICE" yet others are still disagreeing. It feels very much like bashing your head against a wall when we turn the volume up to over 9000 and yet people still say "well actually I don't think that's true..." despite giving no other evidence than the fact that it's their opinion. It's as if we're being totally disregarded in a cloud of opinionation when the only evidence people need is sitting right in front of them. It's incredibly frustrating.

I do understand everything you're saying, but regardless I can't help but feel that this isn't a matter of opinion whatsoever. What causes sexualities, yes, but whether or not they are a choice, no.

I'm sticking to that. But I think this is the third time I've made a post basically rewording this same argument so this will probably be my last one because I don't want to feel like I'm spamming :P

 

[Masqueraine]

You know what grinds my gears? The fact that gays think they're right about the subject simply because they are gay.

Well, despite it grinding your gears, I don't think it's too crazy for multiple gay people to tell you that they can't change this aspect about themselves and that it's not a choice, in a topic dealing with, um, homosexuality.

And if it bothers you that much then you can respond to this post that does no such thing. :) right down there VVVV

To expand on my earlier post, I don't think anybody can say for sure whether somebody is born gay or straight. That being said I strongly consider it. In the womb it has been proven in studies that the male fetus is viewed as an 'outsider' and so the body reacts to it with estrogen, which is why second born and so on sons have a higher chance of being gay, because as we have seen demonstrated through vaccines once a body is introduced to a foreign substance it has an easier time fighting it off. In the case of a human fetus it instills more feminine tendencies, such as homosexuality in males.

The idea that choosing to be a sexuality is like choosing your favorite color is a bit far fetched. Sexuality is an animalistic trait. You cannot mentally choose to change what makes your blood flow faster. Things like your favorite movie, color, and so on have to do with our higher intellectual capability. Animals don't see a color and prefer it the way we do, and they don't watch television and understand what's going on. Our intellectual capacity is always expanding and with it the things we like or prefer, due to these changes that take place.

So I'll have to disagree completely with Penetrait. People don't choose their sexuality, and if we could, I wouldn't be a lesbian. I'm trying to prove your theory right now but so far I still like a pretty lady.

So yeah, now you don't have to be grinded or whatevs.

If that's true, you'd have to also be straight to be right about being straight. But one defines the other. Problem?

Wut. Lol

I chose to be straight when I realized the two aspects of sexual attraction: Physical attraction, and emotional attraction. I can recognize good-looking boys, so that's half the problem solved there. Emotional attraction is no less harder to find, either. But I do not want to be emotionally attracted to any man, and therefore choose to be straight.

Good for you, maybe you're part of the exception. You're really not giving me enough to work with here to actually make a valid argument.

I can recognize good looking people regardless of gender as well, unfortunately I don't see what this does for your argument that sexuality is a choice. And your just being very technical and arbitrary about what making a choice really is, you said that you don't want to be emotionally attracted to a man, so you "choose" not to be with them. But anybody else would look at that as you not liking men. Unless you're bisexual, and are just choosing to prefer one out of two things that you already like, then it's most likely that you're just straight. You didn't choose that, bro.. and if you did were you gay first?

And when you say that you've "chosen" not to be emotionally attached to a man, does that mean you're physically attracted to them? If so then it sounds more to me like you're gay but don't accept that part of yourself, which would make sense with your statement that you won't allow yourself to be emotionally attached to a guy.

And I don't think he's part of the exception, looking at this thread he seems to be a part of the vast majority. XD

You have a point. xD

But still.. people going against the fact that being gay is a choice, when plenty of people who are gay are stressing that it's not a choice.. >_>

You can't really know the complete truth, nor what it's like unless you are gay.
You can't totally know what it's like be transgender, unless you are.
You can't fully know what it's like to ride in an airplane, unless you have before.

People who are heterosexual can learn, and sympathize, and study, and befriend, and guess, explore their own orientations, but unless they really are fully homosexual.. they can't be completely certain enough about it to judge it 100 percent. They can't fully know what goes on inside the minds of people in the LGBT group to know it's not a choice, just like people in said group can't know exactly what it's like to be straight.

This is a good post imo. :)

Just think about it for a second, if people can "choose" to be homosexual, then that means people can also "choose" to be heterosexual.

You can only choose to be something when you're something else to begin with. If you grew up heterosexual you never chose to be heterosexual, because you were never gay to begin with. Likewise with gay people, as demonstrated by everybody in this thread.

 

[Azonic]

I chose to be straight when I realized the two aspects of sexual attraction: Physical attraction, and emotional attraction. I can recognize good-looking boys, so that's half the problem solved there.

It's true that physical and emotional attraction differ. There are many people who are sexually interested in one gender, romantically interested in another (homo/heteromantic / homo/heterosexual).

Not completely convinced by your story though. I mean, recognizing good-looking boys doesn't mean that you get the same sexual stimulation from them. Gay men can recognize a beautiful or hot girl, but they won't get the same sexual stimulation from looking at a hot guy.

Emotional attraction is no less harder to find, either. But I do not want to be emotionally attracted to any man, and therefore choose to be straight.

I'm just not convinced it works like that. What you want to like is not always what you actually DO like. For all we know, you very well could be capable of being emotionally attracted to a man but just avoid that circumstance. I think if you're capable of being emotionally attracted to the same sex in a sexual way, then it does make you bi/homosexual (or at least -romantic)

My colour analogy works just fine. Colour and who you love are the exact same thing when you break it down to what it is, and for that, I redirect you back to my original post.

I dunno. I love the color blue but I don't get boners from looking at it.

I do think sexuality is fluid to some extent. Many people, like bisexuals, report having occasional gay days or straight days in which they just lean towards one gender more than usual. It's limited, not like you can go from Kinsey 6 to Kinsey 0.

Anyways I doubt you can choose what things you like. Perhaps it changes slightly over time, who knows, but I definitely don't think its a conscious decision. If it was, then I could shove bird poop down my throat and say that it was my favorite taste ever.

 

[Nick]

As I said earlier, I believe the only choice someone has on their sexuality is whether they accept being gay or not.

But regarding the opinions mattering and whatnot argument that's going on with a few other people... think of it this way. You have been having chronic headaches for the past few months that come and go every other day. You don't know what the cause is for them, but you want to find out. Who are you going to go to and trust what they're telling you? You're going to go to your doctor. If you're worried, you're going to ask people you know what they think is causing it, but you won't know for certain what the cause is until you go to a doctor.

Relating this example to our discussion, you can ask what other people think where homosexuality comes from (born this way vs choice, in this case), and you can gather their opinions, but the only people who will be able to tell you for certain are people who have experience in this. The only people who truly have experience in this argument are gay people. I say that simply because I know of a lot of girls (specifically) that "go gay" because the men that they've been with have all done them wrong in the past. Does that make them gay? No. They're still going to find men sexually attractive compared to women. They're opening themselves up to another sex. Not because of the sexual orientation, but because of the emotional attachment that they could get with a woman that they never had the ability to find with a man. People think that this automatically changes their sexual orientation, but it doesn't. "Going gay" doesn't affect someone's sexual orientation.

As someone who believes that anyone has the ability to fall in love with anyone, regardless of sexual orientation, I can't change the fact that I find legs to be the most appealing aspect when compared to breasts or butts on a woman just as I can't change the fact that I find a toned stomach (not necessarily abs) to be something that are really attractive on anyone. Suggesting that someone's sexuality is a choice is like suggesting that you can make the choice of trying an exotic food of being good or bad. You taste it, and you like it or you don't. You don't decide whether you like it. As such, if you don't actually like it, you can't make the choice to suddenly like it then have another taste and find it the be the most delicious thing you've ever eaten.

I don't think the people who are saying "I'm gay. I'm telling you that this isn't a choice." are trying to disprove your ability to formulate and express your opinion. They're just telling you that this is how it is as someone who's experienced what it's like to actually be gay. They're a lot more qualified to be able to give you a straight, sure-fire educated answer than someone who hasn't experienced it. Anyone can have an opinion. An opinion is "a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge." You can have your opinion, and believe what you want to believe, but the only people who know the answer are people who have experienced it. Obviously, the only people who can experience actually being gay are gay people. A straight woman can experiment with women all she'd like. She may like it, she may not. But she can't change their sexuality from being straight to gay by just being intimate with a woman. She's still going to find the men sexually appealing. Everyone's entitled to an opinion, but arguing that opinion as fact against people who have experienced being gay and know that it isn't a choice isn't exactly progressive.

You can make the choice to limit yourself to the sex that you're sexually attracted to. You can make the choice of whether or not you want to be with someone, whether you find them sexually desirable or not. You can make the choice to experiment. But when it comes to sexuality in itself, you can't make the choice of being attracted to the same sex or the opposite sex. If you could, then all you would have to do is decide that you are now going to like the same sex sexually, and then suddenly you like them. That isn't how it works. Have any of you that are saying that it's a choice actually have sat there one day and have tried to make the choice of the sex you find sexually appealing? Sure, you may believe that, but have you experienced the moment of making the choice to find men or women (or both) sexually appealing? Did you look at a woman/man and decided "I'm really turned on by her/him!!" There's just a natural reaction in your body that gets you hot when you see someone sexually gratifying. You don't decide it.

Sexuality relates to sexual feelings. And just as you don't decide on the emotion you're feeling, you don't decide your sexuality. That being said, I believe that you can make the choice of whether or not to be open to having a relationship with someone, regardless of your sexuality. But that choice doesn't mean that you're making the choice of being gay or being straight, or even being bi. Relating this, you can make the choice of wanting to be happy, but wanting to be happy doesn't make you happy. A gay person can make the choice of wanting to be straight, but wanting to be straight doesn't make you straight.

 

[Who's Kiyo?]

It's not a choice.

In fact, if we didn't put some much attention on it and accepted it right from the start into society and treated it as a perfectly natural part of human life,

we wouldn't be having this conversation and everyone's lives would be easier.

"Coversion therapy? What's that?"
"Another name for it is gay therapy."
"....Gay therapy? is that- is that like when a guy gives another guy a massage or something?"
"No, it's when someone who is gay goes to a therapist to become straight."
"...."
"What?"
"I don't get it."

 

[deoxys121]

My beliefs in this case: Your sexual orientation is not a choice. You are born that way and it is just a matter of discovering your sexual orientation. In today's generally homophobic society, I can understand why homosexuals would not discover it for several years because of fear of not being accepted, so they try to "convince" themselves to act straight. I am fully accepting of anyone, despite their sexual orientation. I think if the rest of us were like that, the whole world would be a much better place. I think homosexual couples should be allowed to get married and have every right that heterosexual couples have.

 

[Margot]

Well, despite it grinding your gears, I don't think it's too crazy for multiple gay people to tell you that they can't change this aspect about themselves and that it's not a choice, in a topic dealing with, um, homosexuality.

And if it bothers you that much then you can respond to this post that does no such thing. :) right down there VVVV



So yeah, now you don't have to be grinded or whatevs.



Wut. Lol



I can recognize good looking people regardless of gender as well, unfortunately I don't see what this does for your argument that sexuality is a choice. And your just being very technical and arbitrary about what making a choice really is, you said that you don't want to be emotionally attracted to a man, so you "choose" not to be with them. But anybody else would look at that as you not liking men. Unless you're bisexual, and are just choosing to prefer one out of two things that you already like, then it's most likely that you're just straight. You didn't choose that, bro.. and if you did were you gay first?

And when you say that you've "chosen" not to be emotionally attached to a man, does that mean you're physically attracted to them? If so then it sounds more to me like you're gay but don't accept that part of yourself, which would make sense with your statement that you won't allow yourself to be emotionally attached to a guy.

And I don't think he's part of the exception, looking at this thread he seems to be a part of the vast majority. XD


This is a good post imo. :)



You can only choose to be something when you're something else to begin with. If you grew up heterosexual you never chose to be heterosexual, because you were never gay to begin with. Likewise with gay people, as demonstrated by everybody in this thread.

I agree with a lot of this. I think a lot of people are saying "I chose to be straight because I don't want to be with a guy/girl of my gender" are mixing it up with just plain unattraction. If you're choosing to be straight, then you had to understand what it was to be homosexual since you're choosing against it.

And I also fully think that gays have the right to speak about this topic like they know it well because they do. They are gay, they know what it's like, they experience it everyday, they would know if they chose it or not. Saying they can't be experts on it is like saying just because you're straight doesn't mean you know anything about it. If someone came up to me and told me I chose to be straight and live a straight lifestyle, I'd be confused and offended. I never sat down as a five year-old and thought to myself "now....do I want to chase the boys around the playground or the girls? which lifestyle do I want for myself" No, I just like guys. Plain and simple. And I feel I can talk like I know a thing or two about being straight because I am, just like gay people can talk about being gay.

 

[Count]

One thing I don't understand is people who see it as a choice and then clarify it as sexuality being formed by experiences and environment in life. If your sexuality would be formed like that it would not be a choice. Those are two different things; before you say something is a choice please make sure you know what a choice is.

Now for my opinion, I am convinced it is not a choice. You can choose to date men or women, but you don't choose whether you're attracted to men or women.
I am unsure however of how sexuality is formed. I don't know whether I was born this way. There definitely is a difference between emotional attraction and sexual attraction though. I can have a crush on guys as well as girls so I consider myself bisexual. I know that I can be emotionally attracted to both genders. But sexually, I definitely have a preference. Whether I follow that preference, THAT is a choice. But the preference is there. It's part of me.

 

[Azonic]

One thing I don't understand is people who see it as a choice and then clarify it as sexuality being formed by experiences and environment in life. If your sexuality would be formed like that it would not be a choice. Those are two different things; before you say something is a choice please make sure you know what a choice is.

Its just unconscious choice vs. conscious choice. It's definitely not a conscious choice, and an unconscious choice would be doing something that leads to homosexuality without knowing.

At least they acknowledge that you can't just wake up one day and say I'm Straight hhaah

 

[Townes]

Whether or not you can choose to be gay or not, it's not something to be mocked, because it is, very bluntly and probably slightly incorrectly, not being attracted to (in the case of men) boobs and the southern necessities.

 

[tehGDS]

..these posts about how it's a choice is just making me sad.. it's like how inferno said.. it's like choosing to have autism or aspherger's syndrome, you can't choose it.. if I can choose to be straight well can't I choose already? I have been mocked at many times, and also my ex had made me hate giving guys a chance, but that still didn't make me straight, I was not aroused by girls even after that horrible break up. I really don't think it's a choice.. I only say I'm going to turn straight when it's a joke, geez take it as a joke.. >_> lol but um, it's not a choice I really don't think it's a mental disorder either, either you're born with it or not, that is all thank you 8D

 

[Aorio]

Being gay is absolutely not a choice. I get so tired of hearing this. Think of it this way: I could never imagine liking or being attracted to or being in a relationship with another girl. The thought just does not appeal to me whatsoever. Well, that's how it is for someone who is gay, just with the opposite gender. I think it's terrible how someone can be shunned just for loving who they want to love. All the Disney movies I watched growing up taught me to love whoever I want to love. Why is the world trying to tell someone who is gay differently now?

 

[pastelspectre]

I personally think you're born with it. You can't choose it. You don't really realize it, though, until you get to the stage of puberty. I think you're born with it.
But, as for the user who said it is a disorder... what the heck. No, just no. Homosexuality is NOT a disorder. There's absolutely nothing wrong with it. And for people who do think it's wrong, people beside the user who said it's a disorder, is just... I'm disappointed in them. Being gay, there's nothing wrong with it. You're just born with it, and you don't realize it until puberty.
There's nothing wrong with being gay. It's natural. I'm just speaking my thoughts here.

 

[twocows]

I don't think the question matters unless you're trying to understand human sexuality from a scientific perspective. Whether they are born as such or become such through their experiences, the cause doesn't matter. I don't see homosexuality as a problem, so I don't really care. There are more important things to think about and real problems to deal with.

 

[Eruption]

I'm not sure about being born with it. It could be born with it or your surroundings or a mixture of the two.

Either way, it's certainly not a choice.

And I think Atomico's post would surprisingly back up that argument despite it's actual intentions.

In my opinion it's a mental disorder at birth, but I can't be sure about that since I never really do research on it. Either way, being homosexual is not right, there's definitely something wrong there.

Why would you choose to be gay if people think you have a mental disorder because of it?

 

[blue]

Born that way, you can't choose your sexuallity.