Homosexuality

[Shining Raichu]

I'm pretty sure it's a choice. No I'm really sure it's a choice. You can't be born gay. As you grow up, you think to yourself, "I like teh men." And then it goes from there I guess.

Right, that's exactly how it happened for me. I discovered that I "liked teh men." But the distinction must be made, the thought was not "I choose to like teh men."

------------

Honestly, I don't understand this. How many gay people have to post here saying "I DID NOT CHOOSE TO BE GAY" before people believe it? It's ridiculous, and it infuriates me. Do you think we're lying? Do you not think we know better? We're the ones living this out, we know the inner workings of it better than you ever will.

SO. Once more, with feeling:

Gay is not a choice. You do not choose to be gay. I did not choose to be gay. Sexuality is not a choice. Oh my God.

Was that clear enough?

 

[Nick]

This has become a nice, extended discussion. So I'm going to be moving it to Other Chat.

 

[Alley Cat]

I'm pretty sure it's a choice. No I'm really sure it's a choice. You can't be born gay. As you grow up, you think to yourself, "I like teh men." And then it goes from there I guess.

I'll say it again. Do you choose to be straight? No. You just are.
I'm gay. I look at a naked woman, I can't geta hard on. I don't feel anything. I look at a naked man, BAM! There I am. Ready. Do I choose to get a boner? No. Just that boobs and other female bits don't exactly make me pitch a tent.

But.. I could kiss a girl right now. I could have sex, and do whatever the hell I want to with her. But I wont feel something. I wont feel love, I won't feel a connection, and I won't even like it. But can I do it? Yes I can. Doing =/= Desire.

If you watch American Dad, you'll see my point. Stan tries to be gay, but it doesn't work, he doesn't feel anything, and doesn't like it. He's still straight.

 

[Romantica]

I'll say it again. Do you choose to be straight? No.

This is basically the winning point in this discussion. If you can't remember the time you decided to be straight, someone that's gay wouldn't be able to tell you when they decided to prefer their own gender. It's as simple as that.

 

[Alley Cat]

^^ Exactly. The only reason people are believed to choose to be gay, is because the majority of people are straight. But.. if the majority of people were gay, then I'm sure that this discussion would be flipped, and that argument could be used for the straight people. It is just different, and that goes against human's natural survival instinct. Different has a chance to be better, and if you're better, then you will survive longer, so it's in our natural human instinct to take out the competition.

 

[Taemin]

I'm going to agree with Alley Cat, Raichu, and some others.

Although, people keep saying that you can't be born gay, because "there's no gay gene".
but lol..

It's not a gene, it's something that fires in your brain, and your body that makes you attracted to the same gender. Likewise, there's a lack of that firing for people who are homosexual when they're around someone of the opposite gender. It's like how people explain kissing as fireworks going off, since it's feelings and reactions their body has when they're really attracted to whomever they're kissing. With straight people, that happens between a man a woman, with homosexuals, that happens only when both people are of the same gender. People who are bi can feel that with either gender, etc.

From a young age, before there even can be much influence for it in their lives at all, kids can start knowing whether they're attracted to guys or girls. This is before anything that could make it a choice even occurs, mind you.


Some people experience trauma that makes them fearful of the opposite gender, and so due to that fear, they might go against the grain and 'choose' to be homosexual, and that's sad for them, but that's a small percentage. For the most part, gays and lesbians don't choose to become something that makes them an outcast, or causes them depression, or choose something that makes them feel like they're letting their families down. For some, it might be a choice under circumstances that are (most of the time) unfortunate, but in general, we don't choose to be gay. In the same way that we can't suddenly choose to flip that around and become straight. It doesn't work.

 

[Steven]

If it was a choice it wouldn't occur in animals that can't choose.

Just saying.

 

[Alley Cat]

If it was a choice it wouldn't occur in animals that can't choose.

Just saying.

That's a very valid point. Agreed. I've seen it used before, and people try to discredit it because animals aren't humans. But, we have similarities, which is why we use them for testing when we don't want to spare human lives. I forgot about this though, thanks for bringing it up. Do you know any specific cases, though? Other than on Legally Blonde.. heh.

 

[Romantica]

^this was the best example I could think of, alley cat. That article didn't mention that their story was made into a children's book, which is banned from some places (I forgot which exactly) for the mere fact that it's about homosexuality.

 

[Steven]

That's a very valid point. Agreed. I've seen it used before, and people try to discredit it because animals aren't humans. But, we have similarities, which is why we use them for testing when we don't want to spare human lives. I forgot about this though, thanks for bringing it up. Do you know any specific cases, though? Other than on Legally Blonde.. heh.

People say animals aren't humans as in animals screw whoever whenever. But what about birds? Birds (generally) have one partner their entire life (..unlike humans). Yet, homosexuality occurs in birds. The best examples of this are Bald Eagles, Penguins, and Vultures. There are other animal species that are just as (if not more) monogamous such as red-backed salamanders, prarie voles, and wolves.

Penguins and wolves though don't have the same partners their entire life. They just have on partner at a time (like humans.)

 

[Alley Cat]

I heard that once Penguins find their mate they stay together for life?

But that's a bit off-topic. I do believe though that this discussion is dying.
So....

In many countries in Africa, homosexuality is only illegal for males, what difference is this?

 

[RHIOneAlbum]

I think that you are equal no matter what, and that "gay" shouldn't mean homosexual, but since it's so prominent as an insult, it can continue to be an insult, not meaning homosexual though

I myself are asexual, and I get absolute hell from straights saying that I haven't met the right person... Like seriously, they don't know me. Also, Christian, Muslim, and Jewish religions don't believe in it. Reformed Judaism and I'm sure some versions of Christianity and Islam approve, but for the most part, it's death penalty. (Saudi Arabia is an example)

Why can't people focus on other things than sexuality... Seems as if lives are ran by sexual relationships in many people I've met. I don't know anybody other than myself who could live without ever hearing about all of it. Its ANNOYING and SAD that people are ran by their desire to get a gf/bf and crack jokes about it. I haven't heard a FUNNY JOKE in a long time tat didn't involve sexuality -_-

 

[FreakyLocz14]

I was raised Catholic and to believe that homosexuality was wrong. I had never met an actual homosexual (that I knew of). I was expecting the men to be stereotypical effeminate types. The first one I met in 6th grade was not that at all. He was that gangster type.

 

[Winter Wonderland]

In my opinion it's a mental disorder at birth, but I can't be sure about that since I never really do research on it. Either way, being homosexual is not right, there's definitely something wrong there.

Response
I fail to see what's so wrong about it. There's nothing wrong with it. It's just a matter of love. Which, really, shouldn't cause this much hate. Why would it be a disorder to love someone that just happens to be the same gender as you? Furthermore, why should it matter to you, in any way, who someone loves. Gay people might think being straight is a mental disorder, and you'd damn them to hell for it. Also, if you haven't really done any research on it, why would you comment saying such a controversial thing? You're not having an opinion. You're just being really close-minded and stuck in the dark ages.

Some thoughts
A lot of people think one thing wrong with being gay is you can't create babies. A majority of human beings will never have sex to create babies. I for one, will never have sex with any boyfriend I have to create a child. I would only do it out of pleasure. People who are gay are completely normal. Sex is an abnormal thing. And the way people decide to do it is their business, not yours, and it's rather silly for you to judge someone based on who they want to kiss and marry.

Choice

On the subject of choice, there's simply no discussion to be had about it. The only people who would choose a lifestyle that leads to the loss of friends, depression, alienation, suicide, and hate is a masochistic person. Thinking logically, the only choices a gay person can make about being gay are

• To hide it
• To show it
• To be proud
• To be ashamed

So, as you can see, the choices of being gay are EXTREMELY limited. To be quite honest with all of you, I'm a straight person, but I have a few gay friends and it sickens me to my very core if they're mistreated for their sexuality.

The really gay scenario
Let's try a bit of role reversal. If the "normal" sexuality was homosexuality, and you were straight, how would you feel? You're a minority, you're discriminated against, you lose friends constantly 'cause they think you wanna boink them. We, as children, learned the golden rule, correct?

Treat others how you want others to treat you.

With that being said, would you want people to think you were diseased? Would you honestly want people to hate you for liking someone of the opposite gender? Think about it; the world hates you, according to most religions(since the role was reversed), you have a seat waiting for you in eternal hell, and everywhere you go, there will be hate crimes against your kind. Sounds like hell, right? Sounds like you're being used to release anger. No one wants to be treated that way. Why anyone on this Earth would think it's alright to alienate someone the way people have alienated homosexuals, the jewish in the past, africans, is beyond me. Worst of all, you didn't choose to be this way, it just happened. And the only thing you can do is hide it or be proud. If nothing else, take a lesson of common courtesy and treat others how you would like to be treated.

The awkward truth
All-in-all, there's nothing wrong with homosexuality. Whether you believe so or not, just break it down logically, and you'll see that there isn't. It's just another thing that happens in nature such as retardation, genius, different color pigmentation, and so on. Anywho, that's my thoughts on it.

 

[Full Metal]

I'd say Louis C.K. sums it up pretty well ( ... ) .
People seriously need to quit being judgmental. :\
IDK. I haven't had an attraction to other guys, so I don't think I was born that way. If it's not that we're born that way, and it is a choice, then I don't plan on choosing it because I'm happily off the market with my girlfriend. But I mean, I have a friend who is gay and he seemed very curious about other guys. So, there's something to be said for both sides of the argument ( "choosing" to be gay, or "born that way" ). Regardless, I still think Louis C.K. sums it up pretty well. haha. :)

 

[Steven]

In my opinion it's a mental disorder at birth, but I can't be sure about that since I never really do research on it. Either way, being homosexual is not right, there's definitely something wrong there.

So..let me get this straight. You have done absolutely no research on the subject, yet you still come up with a completely bigoted and hateful rational against homosexuality, then when people try to give you information (such as how every psychology-based assosiation and profession agrees nearly unanimously that homosexuality is NOT a mental disorder) you ignore it.

I think it's a choice due to your surroundings


:t354:TG

..That's a completely contradicting statement. People farther south are tan because of their surroundings (i.e. more sunlight). So they chose to be tan?

People have points with that "why would you chose to be discriminated against" point. It's more accepted now so people can chose it but I think it's more of a fashion mentality. Oh I think this once, it's what I am. You can chose what to be in life.

In the words of the great Kathy Griffin;

"Were you born a bigot or did you grow into one?"

 

[Shining Raichu]

What I really don't understand is why this is open to discussion. People saying things like "it's a choice in my opinion." I'm sorry, your opinion? This isn't something people get to have opinions on. This is not like abortion or even same-sex marriage where people's views do matter. This is a simple statement of fact:

Gay is not a choice.

This is not something where it's appropriate to say "No, I don't think so. That's not true, in my opinion." Unless you yourself are gay, you do not get a vote. You do not get to have a contrary opinion. And the gay people - the ones who this is actually concerning - are all pretty unanimous in saying that it's not something you choose. So what else is there to debate?

So..let me get this straight. You have done absolutely no research on the subject, yet you still come up with a completely bigoted and hateful rational against homosexuality, then when people try to give you information (such as how every psychology-based assosiation and profession agrees nearly unanimously that homosexuality is NOT a mental disorder) you ignore it.

Well if it's a mental disorder, it's the best one I've ever had ;) I didn't choose this but I certainly enjoy it lol

 

[Abnegation]

I honestly don't see why there is such a lack of tolerance when it comes to the homosexual community. So a person is attracted to members of the same sex, so what? I prefer brunettes to blonds, that doesn't give someone the right to discriminate against me, nor does it make my preferences incorrect. Human emotions and preferences are shaped by nature, and grow upon the nature of their nurture.

In my opinion it's a mental disorder at birth, but I can't be sure about that since I never really do research on it. Either way, being homosexual is not right, there's definitely something wrong there.

I really had to bite my lip on that one. I don't think you can say something is wrong and classify it as a "mental disorder" if you have also noted that you've not done your research.

I simply think people wallow too much in the traditional, gender roles have been changing over the decades. This is 2011, not the dawn of mankind where women were merely child bearers within their caves while the men played the role of hunter-gatherers. It is quite secluded and short sighted for anyone to simply think homosexuality is a wrong thing, it's just another term much like heterosexuality, and who knows, in 50 years, the majority of people could be homosexual.

In the sense of reproduction, homosexuality is obviously going to be counter productive, but other than that, what issues can there possibly be? I don't think the masses are very concerned with birth rates, so there shouldn't be objection to it, in my eyes. It's simply a built in attraction, which cannot be justly classified as being "wrong". From a completely secular view of course.

 

[Patatas Fritas]

It is NOT a CHOICE it will NEVER be a CHOICE.
You are BORN gay, it's an UNCHANGEABLE aspect of your GENES and due to circumstances in the WOMB. The very thought that any sane person would choose to lead a life where so many people hate them just for being attracted to the same sex is absurd, my cousin is a lesbian and I can safely say that she did NOT CHOOSE to be attracted to women, and the stereotypical signs of being homosexual where there from a very YOUNG age, which backs up the whole being born gay thing. While I agree you do not know your sexuality until you hit puberty and the hormone rush begins but there are generally going to be signs of it beforehand.

So yeah, if you tl;dr this I'm basically saying:
It's >NOT< a >CHOICE< -- You >ARE BORN GAY<

 

[FreakyLocz14]

Idk what causes homosexuality, but I'm not comfortable saying that one is born that way without conclusive, peer-reviewed, scientific evidence that has achieved a general consensus among the scientific community.